Affect of Incendiary/Fire on AI

[Timbukto]

Hi guys, long-time x-com fan, but new forum member. Playing x-com EU PSX on my PSP right now on superhuman. It's a very nice version considering how historically bad pc-to-console ports can be and even fixes a few bugs in the PC version (i.e. pay for dirt and base maintenance display I believe). You only really get 2 save slots in this version and save/reloads take a good while so it tends to deter abusing save/reloads (i.e. but you should always keep a safe geoscape save on hand with guys present at your base or you can be caught with no save games or opportunity to bail you out on a base retaliation mission).

 

Anyways does anyone know about the affect of incendiary/fire on AI and enemy movement? An idea came to me on whether you could use incendiary rounds not only as additional lighting but to smother the area temporarily with a 'fire' blockade (which could be useful on both base assaults and defense). I'll most likely try it out myself, but I was wondering if someone has already done some studies on this on how it influences enemy movement and attacks if at all, etc. Will the AI ever decide to walk through a wall of fire to take potshots, etc?

[Zombie]

Hi guys, long-time x-com fan, but new forum member. Playing x-com EU PSX on my PSP right now on superhuman. It's a very nice version considering how historically bad pc-to-console ports can be and even fixes a few bugs in the PC version (i.e. pay for dirt and base maintenance display I believe). You only really get 2 save slots in this version and save/reloads take a good while so it tends to deter abusing save/reloads (i.e. but you should always keep a safe geoscape save on hand with guys present at your base or you can be caught with no save games or opportunity to bail you out on a base retaliation mission).

Welcome to the forums, Timbukto! I myself started off plating X-COM on the Playstation and know exactly what you mean about long load times and the necessity of saving often in the Geoscape. It makes, no, forces you to play honest because reloading a battlescape save takes almost a minute. The saving grace of this has to be all the bug fixes though. Blaster Bombs fly properly, Proximity Grenades work as advertised, missions end when all the aliens are killed/stunned/or under your control and you can open doors without walking through with a right click. Gotta love it, even if the load times are sometimes prohibitive.

 

Anyways does anyone know about the affect of incendiary/fire on AI and enemy movement? An idea came to me on whether you could use incendiary rounds not only as additional lighting but to smother the area temporarily with a 'fire' blockade (which could be useful on both base assaults and defense). I'll most likely try it out myself, but I was wondering if someone has already done some studies on this on how it influences enemy movement and attacks if at all, etc. Will the AI ever decide to walk through a wall of fire to take potshots, etc?

I haven't studied this in-depth but aliens seem to be rather stupid and don't really know if a fire is between them and you. They will frequently walk straight through a blaze even if it means getting injured or set on fire. So go ahead and use copious amounts of fire to blanket an alien "hot zone". It's most gratifying to hear the sizzle of alien meat on the barbie.

 

- Zombie

[Timbukto]

Welcome to the forums, Timbukto! I myself started off plating X-COM on the Playstation and know exactly what you mean about long load times and the necessity of saving often in the Geoscape. It makes, no, forces you to play honest because reloading a battlescape save takes almost a minute. The saving grace of this has to be all the bug fixes though. Blaster Bombs fly properly, Proximity Grenades work as advertised, missions end when all the aliens are killed/stunned/or under your control and you can open doors without walking through with a right click. Gotta love it, even if the load times are sometimes prohibitive.

 

 

I haven't studied this in-depth but aliens seem to be rather stupid and don't really know if a fire is between them and you. They will frequently walk straight through a blaze even if it means getting injured or set on fire. So go ahead and use copious amounts of fire to blanket an alien "hot zone". It's most gratifying to hear the sizzle of alien meat on the barbie.

 

- Zombie

 

Actually I started with the PC version and I'm just revisiting it on the PSX-PSP to complete in superhuman. Then I will move on to TFTD and maybe even Apoc. Both of which I haven't really touched. The PSP plays ok and the saves are slow but I don't think they take a minute (there is no need for actual cd-rom reading when run on the PSP however). Definitely far slower than any modern PC however and the limited number of save slots makes you use it when you really should (i.e. a safe geoscape save + a safe beginning of turn battlescape save).

 

I ask about the fire + AI because to UFOpaedia explicitly mentions it.

 

https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Incendiary

 

"Unarmored soldiers can walk through fire unscathed, but don't be left standing on or next to a burning tile at the end of the turn. That's when the fire-spreading code runs. Incendiaries also restrict alien movement; they, too, try to avoid fire."

 

So I was wondering if this is a known truism or just an observation. Anyways I'll be testing this myself to see. It could be if it works the same as with a soldier that the alien is safe to run through the fire, but will attempt to not end its turn on top or next to fire. Regardless I want to see if it is a factor at all in the actual AI.

[Bomb Bloke]

It wouldn't surprise me if it's different between EU/TFTD. For all intents and purposes, they're the same game (though TFTD makes less sense), but there are some minor tweaks here and there.

[Zombie]

I ask about the fire + AI because to UFOpaedia explicitly mentions it.

 

https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php?title=Incendiary

 

"Unarmored soldiers can walk through fire unscathed, but don't be left standing on or next to a burning tile at the end of the turn. That's when the fire-spreading code runs. Incendiaries also restrict alien movement; they, too, try to avoid fire."

 

So I was wondering if this is a known truism or just an observation. Anyways I'll be testing this myself to see. It could be if it works the same as with a soldier that the alien is safe to run through the fire, but will attempt to not end its turn on top or next to fire. Regardless I want to see if it is a factor at all in the actual AI.

The X-COM wiki is a collaboration between a lot of people. Sometimes things are written which have little to do with reality but more to do with hope. That said, I can't really see how aliens could detect fire. Unless there is some coding in the executable which accesses SMOKREF.DAT every round, the aliens are basically oblivious to it.

 

A while back I was doing some tests on a large scout by exploiting the feature that the diagonal walls by the bridge allow fire to pass through. Fired an incendiary rocket into the wall every other round, then checked the aliens positions. No movement. (Well, they may have moved during their turn but ended up in the same spots at the end). If they could detect fire and were coded to avoid it, they would have moved to the opposite side of the bridge or took refuge in the engine room. This didn't happen.

 

- Zombie

[Timbukto]

Not a conclusive test by any means, but I fired an AC-I round and completely surrounded a sectoid with fire and it chose to stand there. It had no LOS to any of my soldiers. On a reload I missed slightly (i.e. sectoid wasn't surrounded by fire) and the sectoid chose to travel off. Now I'm not sure about random alien movement, but maybe the fact that aliens just sit still in fire is the AI effect of having its movement blocked (certainly not smart AI, but an AI affect regardless). Will try to do more tests later, just been playing through the game and using it now and then.

[Timbukto]

Did a few more scenarios and looks like there isn't anything conclusive to show that AI reacts to fire. I've seen them sit in it, move through/out of it, etc. The only scenario I haven't tested yet is if an Alien that isn't near fire is willing to intentionally walk into one for whatever reason.

 

Regardless it still is a decent way to do long distance lighting without high item count (I use auto-cannon + laser pistol). Also although incendiary as a weapon is definitely weak and slow, it can go through armor and do enough to soften up enemy firing accuracy.

[Knan]

Yup. AC-I is THE way to do lighting on night terror sites, IMO.