The Road To Cydonia

[Bomb Bloke]

I think I heard somewhere that you needed to get a Commander from a base (as opposed to somewhere else) if you wanted to go to Cydonia. Is this the case?

[Jman4117]

I've gotten them from battleships before and went to Cydonia so no.

[Zombie]

I always get my commanders from battleships, and they give up the info necessary for the trip to Cydonia. I'm not sure if other versions of the game actually need a Base commander to get to Cydonia. The Unofficial Strategy Guide by Kasey Chang claims you do. But then again, this guide has been wrong before.

 

For me, nabbing a commander from a battleship is a whole lot easier than getting one froma base. See, in a base the commander is usually (not always) found in the command center. On top of this, the commander is found upstairs along with some leaders and maybe a navigator or two. Stunning the commander is near impossible without Small Launchers, as you need to go upstairs to stun the commander with a Stun Rod. Also, you almost need to have a Mind Probe along to see if one of those aliens is indeed a commander.

 

Getting one from a battleship is way easier. At least the commander will be found on level 2 of the battleship where you can surprise him with sneak stunning attacks from multiple directions!

[NKF]

I've said this before: A commander's a commander's a commander.

 

The game makes no distinction between where you obtained the commander. They're stored the same way in the containment file.

 

The main prerequisite for "Cydonia or bust" is that you've researched "The Martian Solution" before researching a commander. Which in turn needs Alien Origins and a leader/commander.

 

Now, the species of the alien may factor in somehow, but I've gotten COB from a floater commander. That kind of gives me the impression any old commander will do.

 

- NKF

[Bomb Bloke]

I must confess that just before making this thread, I got a Commander from a Battleship and used it to go to Cydonia.

 

So why ask? 'Cause I thought I'd seen someone say otherwise. Must have been that USG.

[kai]

As far as I was aware, ships had a Leader on board and the bases had a Leader and a Commander

[Bomb Bloke]

Some larger craft hold leaders. Commanders can be obtained from Battleships, or raids on your/the aliens bases.

[Zombie]

I should probably note that the only craft where you can find an alien leader is:

 

Harvester

Abductor

Terror Ship

Supply Ship

Battleship

You can also find leaders in alien bases, X-COM base defense missions, the missions to Mars and Terror Sites.

 

Alien Commanders can only be found in the Battleship, and the three base missions.

 

The number of leaders you could expect depends also on skill level. Mostly, there will be only one leader for the medium-large UFO's. The Abductor will have between 1 and 2 regardless of level, and the Battleship/Alien Base/X-COM Base Defense will have 1 on Beginner/Experienced, 2 on Veteran/Genius, and 3 on Superhuman. You should only expect one Commander for the Battleship, alien base, and X-COM base defense missions. On Cydonia, you could see 3-5 Sectoid Commanders depending on skill level, and in the base below, the same number of Ethereal Commanders.

 

The exceptions are with the different races. Not every race has leaders or commanders, therefore, you will not see them in the medium-larger UFO's. You won't see a Muton Abductor or Harvester because Mutons don't participate in those sorts of activities and Muton Leaders don't exist.

[Jman4117]

I see Muton Harvesters regularly, they just don't have the leaders onboard.

[Zombie]

Yep, you are right Jman4117. What the %&@#! was I thinking, anyhow? Yes, Muton Harvesters and Abductors do show up. However, they probably happen less often than say, a Floater Harvester or a Sectoid Abductor. Those seem to be the most frequent races associated with these type of vessels. (At least for me).

 

On an alien-commander related topic: I suppose a few of us get our commanders from alien base missions. Here is my question to all of you: Where do you find the alien commander in the base? In the command center? Here is what the OSG says about this subject:

Official Strategy Guide, by Dave Ellis (pg. 291)

The most useful consequence of an alien base assault is the possibility of capturing an alien commander. Nearly every base has a commander, and only these high-ranking aliens have the information you need in order to travel to Mars and win the game. Because the capture of a commander plays such a key role in the game, you should never go to an alien base assault without some sort of stun weapon.

 

The base commander is always in the command center of the base.

One time, just recently, I went to a Floater base to kick some genetically engineered anti-gravity alien butt. Picture this: The two staging rooms are at the lower-left and lower-right of the map, while the command center is at the top center of the map. I initiated a "battle line" of my troops and then started to move them little by little to the top of the battlescape. Every round or so one of my scouts would spot a Floater, and my troops would kill it. Needless to say, because the staging areas were so far from the command center, and my slow movement between rounds, the nearest bunch of soldiers didn't get to the top of the map for 15-20 rounds.

 

Since I really wanted to capture an alien commander alive, my troops were using the Mind Probe to determine if each alien was a commander. I sent one group of soldiers into the command center to hopefully stun the commander, while the other half of my troops was stationed on "over-watch" to the right of the command center just in case a few stragglers wandered by. After searching the command center from top to bottom, no Floater Commander was found. Where was he? Outside the command center hiding in the shadows near where my soldiers stationed on over-watch were!

 

I'm thinking that the reason why the Commander was outside the command center "proper" was because it took so long to get my troops there. When they did arrive, the commander had a good 15 rounds of movement under his belt, which happened to take him outside the normal search envelope. I mean, why would the OSG steadfastly maintain that the commander always is inside the command center? Initially, maybe. But is there something in the game that prevents such movement from happening? I doubt it.

 

Anyone else absolutely recall seeing a commander outside the command structure? Any thoughts here?

[Bomb Bloke]

I've seen an alien in a base well away from the command center, carrying a blaster launcher. Most likely a leader, but still rare in my experiance.

 

Perhaps it's the case that combat (grenades and such) lured teh commander out of the top area? Dunno.

[NKF]

Well, in that 20x20 base module with the corridor leading to a lift that goes up to four moderate sized storage rooms, it almost always has an alien with a blaster launcher inside it. At least, I'm always finding an alien with a blaster launcher in that general area. I mean, I'm always bumping into one when I burst through the doors, or I get blown to bits if I don't get to the lift in time.

 

Not sure about the rank though.

 

- NKF

[Zombie]

Sure, I see the same thing in that module. Usually an alien with a Blaster Launcher is found in one of the upper rooms. As for rank, the alien is either an Engineer or a Soldier. I'm not saying this is 100% true or anything, but with all the alien base missions I've been on, the rank I always see there is either an Engineer or Soldier.

 

And in practice, I never barge in uninvited just to get greeted by a face full of a red-hot Blaster Bomb. Camp outside that lower door and peek in every round or so. For especially tough aliens like Mutons, a Proxy mine at the base of the lift does wonders to thwart a retaliatory Blaster Bomb strike. When it goes boom, move your soldiers inside and kill the alien if it's still alive!

[NKF]

Or just wait till the alien with the blaster suddenly decides to come after you. I like to burst into the room and, well, laugh at it while it squirms helplessly. Oh and plug the lift. No way do I want it to get away and fire off a shot.

 

In the CE, the reason I like to get to the lift in time is to take advantage of the vertical blaster bomb bug. Just block up the lift and it'll commit suicide.

 

A waste of a good blaster bomb, but oh well...

 

- NKF

[Zombie]

Oh, yeah. The vertical blaster bomb bug. I almost forgot about that one! Sure, the computer versions have this "flaw" but the PSX version doesn't. (See why I like playing the PSX version? You may fire Blaster Bombs any direction you want and it will expertly follow the waypoints you select). Unfortunately though, what's good for the goose is also good for the gander. If I can select vertical waypoints in the PSX, the aliens can do the same. Not good!

 

Plugging the lift with a soldier to prevent that alien from wandering off or using it's Blaster Launcher against your troops may work for most situations, but not all. Why? While somewhat rare, there may be multiple aliens in those rooms upstairs. The alien with the Blaster Launcher always outranks the second alien. He then becomes a "spotter" for the second alien which usually carries a Plasma weapon. For your soldier plugging the lift, its curtains, since a plasma shot to the head is almost always fatal. And if that alien can't fire his weapon, he usually has an alien grenade as a backup.

 

I have seen the second alien (usually a soldier) carry a plasma rifle or heavy plasma. In a few instances, I have even seen a Terrorist (Silacoid or a Celatid for a Muton base, or a Chryssalid for a Snakeman base) upstairs along with a friend carrying a Blaster Launcher. While the Silacoid and Chryssalid are rendered harmless due to the fact they only have a HTH attack, the Celatid is really dangerous. With more damage than a Heavy Plasma, the Celatid's acid spit is probably the most potent shot you'll ever encounter. One shot down the lift to your soldiers head is like shooting an arrow at Jello!

[NKF]

True, true. Prefer to play the dos version myself, which has no trouble with vertical blaster bombs either. Just play the CE because I want to play X-Com on my new PC.

 

Actually, alien don't seem to know how to shoot down 1-tile lifts (edit: With their plasma weapons, I mean). 2x2 lifts appear to pose no problem, so that's fine. They also don't seem to know how to toss grenades down lifts either. Not that I'm complaining or anything.

 

I notice this quiet a lot in the supply ships, where one of my main strategies is to plug the two lifts with soldiers, and then take on the rest of the ship at my leisure.

 

- NKF

[Zombie]

Here again, aliens can shoot down the 1x1 lifts in the PSX version. They also can chuck grenades down too. Quite dangerous to physically plug the lift when aliens are raining plasma bolts down on the soldiers head.

 

Hmmm. I thought that the Celatid has an arcing shot. Therefore, it should be able to shoot down 1x1 lifts. I know they can in the PSX version, but what about the computer? Anyone know?

[Bomb Bloke]

What is this verticial blaster bomb bug of which you speak?

[Zombie]

What? You haven't heard of this bug?

 

In short, you cannot place a waypoint directly above or below another waypoint, otherwise it flies off in some direction (NKF, help me out here: is it a southwesterly drift)? To navigate a Blaster Bomb to go down a 1x1 lift, you need to send the bomb down on an angle. The aliens don't know this trick, and therefore blow themselves up!

[Bomb Bloke]

Er, what? I'm reasonably sure I've done that with no trouble...

 

Which versions of the game does this affect?

[NKF]

The Collectors Edition. No problems in the original dos edition.

 

Methinks it might be a problem with the return values for fatan(), or whatever function they use to determine particle velocity thingummy. The thingy that makes the thingy that makes the bullet go. Blast, spend a few months away from programming and the terminology turns into spaghetti.

 

The directions I base off the overhead map. With North being the direction you exit from the Skyranger, and South being the direction the Skyranger's nose points. In the isometric map, north is the top right corner fo the map, and south is the lower left.

 

- NKF

[Bomb Bloke]

That's an odd bug to develop in the port. Not what I'd expect, given that they didn't bother to fix any (many?) of the old ones.

[NKF]

My only guess is that the trigonometric function used in the port is expecting an 8-bit return value but gets a 16-bit value instead, and after its recasts the value into an 8-bit value, it doesn't quite get the answer it wants.

 

- NKF

[Bomb Bloke]

Hrm. Could be something along those lines. I can see that that would cause problems.