Strange things in X-COM

[Fishfins]

-Phantom Craft terrorises Alien Invaders-

 

Aliens everywhere had reason to fear flying over occupied America.

 

"...is it really true?" One sectoid asked another.

 

"Why won't it go away?" Wailed another, moments before his craft was shot down straight into Lake Michigan, and several hours after it started stalking them.

 

"...through I walk through the valley I death, I shall fear..." Prayed a Terror Ship crew before a mission.

 

Hysterical aliens sent scouting mission after scouting mission towards the continent to find the Phantom Avenger, and each mission ended at the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean or one of the great lakes of Canada. Was it a ghost? Did Earthican technology bypass theirs to the point that they could put a craft in the air for eternity? Or was it yet another odd bug?

 

---

 

The strangest bug happened to me earlier. I sent an Avenger on it's first mission to destory an alien infiltration mission. After the craft were blown up, I noticed the Avenger had 0% Fuel left, and was still flying around happily as I ordered it to shoot down more scout ships. I ordered it to patrol, and it hovered around for several days until I decided to reload and order it back home.

 

I'm not sure if this is the cause, but I manufactured the Avenger in one base, fueled it up there and sent it to a new base which did not have any Elerium available (though there was Elerium in transit).

[NKF]

That, my friend, is the infinite fuel bug. Happens if you transfer a ship that's refuelling (usually if it's recently purchased or built) to a new base, and then sending it out immediately. The game sets their status to ready, rather than continue to refuel it.

 

See, the game's bingo point where it sends the ships back home is at the 50% mark. Since you never get to hit the 50% mark, because you launched the ship under the 50% fuel mark, the game never tells them to go home. The game was never designed so that your ship crashed once fuel hit 0, since your ships are meant to be hardcoded to return home once fuel hits fifty.

 

I guess this could have been avoided if they'd used a 'if(fuel

 

- NKF

[Pete]

I dunno eh? Amateurs

[Zombie]

See, the game's bingo point where it sends the ships back home is at the 50% mark. Since you never get to hit the 50% mark, because you launched the ship under the 50% fuel mark, the game never tells them to go home. The game was never designed so that your ship crashed once fuel hit 0, since your ships are meant to be hardcoded to return home once fuel hits fifty.

This may be true for interceptions taking place half-way across the globe, but try intercepting with a Skyranger or Interceptor sometime. Keep plotting waypoints close to your base and you can get fuel to 1%! I assume that since the game knows that the ship is so close to home, it will allow it to use up almost all of it's fuel before returning. Distance plays a role. Try this with Elerium-fueled craft, and the result is the same: intercepting can reduce fuel lower than the 50% mark.

 

Patrolling is a different matter. The normal X-COM craft can patrol directly over home base until 1% fuel is used. The advanced craft which use Elerium for fuel cannot patrol any longer than the 50% bingo point.

 

- Zombie

[Faskalia]

I have a strange save game from tftd.

 

The first USO to appear lands on jamaica and when i send my triton over the game crashes

If anyone wants it, just pm me. (I am curretnly too lazy to get some net hosting )

[Blehm 98]

actually, you can go below 50%, the game keeps track of point of no return, or at least it does if you launch with 100% fuel, which is normally the only way.

 

yes, if you are intercepting or patrolling for something, once you get near the point of no return, you can head back to your base and you can get quite low

[Rattler]

I've had the bezerking thing happen before too. It was the oddest way too. I was playing TFTD, Mag Ion armour and sonic cannon armed men stormed a MC activity site, I killed like only 3 aliens, found the entrance tot he lower portion had the last guy with TUs drop down a level and peer in. There was just one tasoth standing there, I shot(can't remember if I hit or missed). Ended my turn and the that Tasoth went bezerk, and emptied his entire sonic rifle at my man(hit him like 7or 9 times, 15+fatal wounds), my turned came up I shot him and killed him and checked his body, his gun had I think a full clip minus one round.

 

 

This other time I started a game built my base in europe, went through the usual first month stuff at the end of the month I was told we a alien base had been found in europe. So I looked, and there wasn't any, then a few days later a UFO popped up so I clicked on my base to send off an interceptor......thats when I found the base, Could either select from X-Com 1(actually back then I was naming them after Warhammer 40K chapters) or Alien Base-21.....thats not a typo that was his 21first base

 

 

One odd but funny thing is in TFTD accidently shot my own man with a disrupter pulse launcher, 526 days in the hospital. I normaly place the first waypoint just any where, in this case a ways behind the guy. Its never hit him before but this time it did.

 

 

I included TFTD cause well TFTD and UFO share probablly all of the same bugs and glitches and weirdness.

[Bomb Bloke]

Fifteen fatal wounds? Five hundred and twenty six days in hospital??

 

How many maximum hit points do your units have?

[JellyfishGreen]

I was told an alien base had been found in europe. So I looked, and there wasn't any, then a few days later a UFO popped up so I clicked on my base to send off an interceptor......thats when I found the base, Could either select from X-Com 1(actually back then I was naming them after Warhammer 40K chapters) or Alien Base-21.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Heh. I've heard of bases being close, but never that close. I imagine if you zoomed in, though, they'd be on the other side of the mountain, at least. But imagine:

- An alien supply ship lands on the helipad and starts offloading food vats, then realizes its mistake and leaves quickly.

- A UFO is detected heading straight for the base, base defenses are scrambled, then the UFO just...disappears on the other side of the mountain.

- your base construction company, tunnelling deep under the mountain, stops and hears someone else digging, or worse: "Why did you stop digging?" "Well, we reached a tunnel." "Funny, I don't remember building a tunnel there. And certainly not a room full of alien artifacts."

[Zombie]

Hmmm... I'm pretty sure we talked about how X-COM's collision detection system is a little bit "screwy". You know the deal: leading 2x2 tanks up a single width stairwell, having your men peek through to the floor above by standing on hay bales, chucking grenades through ceilings, or even walking through certain diagonal UFO walls. But I was recently doing some testing (what's new) and got the shock of my life:

 

 

What the... ? Huh? The darn guy actually is standing on the landing strut of the Avenger! I know how it happened: I was trying to move the first guy (standing on the equipment pile) down the ramp, but placed the destination indicator on Level 1 instead. When I clicked, the guy made a bee-line and then headed straight for the leg of the Avenger. Before reloading the game to try and duplicate the results, I got smart and took a screenshot. After reloading and trying again and again, I was unable to get it to happen. Darn it.

 

Actually, standing on a strut could be a life saver. If an alien shoots and misses your trooper, the bullet hits the strut instead. Pity I didn't save the game too. I would have liked to experiment a bit with this rare (?) scenario.

 

- Zombie

[falkor95]

Hmmm... I'm pretty sure we talked about how X-COM's collision detection system is a little bit "screwy". You know the deal: leading 2x2 tanks up a single width stairwell, having your men peek through to the floor above by standing on hay bales, chucking grenades through ceilings, or even walking through certain diagonal UFO walls. But I was recently doing some testing (what's new) and got the shock of my life:

 

- Zombie

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Zombie I never knew about that stuff as I assumed it wouldn't work just shows you

 

worst of all was the logic in tallying up which "survivors" would make it back

 

e.g. 3 soldiers STUNNED down on the battlefield, 2 soldiers in other soldiers back packs being returned to the avenger, suddenly the mission is won (all aliens killed) but do the 3 stunned soldiers make it back? do the soldiers in back packs make it back?

[Gimli]

Don't know if this was mentioned, but did anyone ever see the "warp" thing in Avenger?

[Zombie]

Zombie I never knew about that stuff as I assumed it wouldn't work  just shows you

 

worst of all was the logic in tallying up which "survivors" would make it back

 

e.g. 3 soldiers STUNNED down on the battlefield, 2 soldiers in other soldiers back packs being returned to the avenger, suddenly the mission is won (all aliens killed) but do the 3 stunned soldiers make it back? do the soldiers in back packs make it back? 

Actually, if you win the mission normally by killing/incapacitating all the aliens, any stunned soldiers will make it back to base. Simple as that. Doesn't matter where they are either - in a backpack, in the hands, inside the landing craft or somewhere on the battlescape.

 

However, stunned soldiers are a little bit different if you decide to abort the mission instead. Here is an excerpt from some studies I did on this a while back:

 

1) Soldier [conscious] left outside when you evacuate. Result: MIA for -20 points. This is a concrete number, and will not change with the rank of a soldier.

2) A stunned soldier on or off a landing craft when you evacuate. Result: 0 points. Same deal here, the number is not rank dependant.

3) A soldier is stunned and blown up with an explosive blast inside or outside the landing craft. Result: 0 points. Again, this is a fixed number and cannot be changed.

6) A soldier under alien control inside or outside the craft when evacuating. Result: MIA for -20 points. Need I say it again? Not rank dependant.

7) A soldier under alien control and stunned inside OR outside the landing craft when evacuating. Result: MIA for -20 points.

 

Here are a couple more scenarios that I thought of and tested.

8) A soldier that is shot and killed while under alien control inside or outside of the craft when you dust-off. Result: same points as if the soldier is just killed normally. This is rank and skill dependant.

9) A soldier under alien control, stunned and blown up with an explosive blast inside or outside the craft when you dust-off. Result: same points as if the soldier was is killed normally. Rank and skill dependant.

Never really checked if they made it back to base though. However, in any of the above tests where the soldier is considered MIA or KIA, that will not change the result.

 

For the tests where the soldier is stunned and you abort (2 & 3), I did some research into this just now to see if they make it back or not.

 

For condition 2:

 

Stunned outside the craft and you abort. Result: 0 pts, and soldier does not make it back to base.

Stunned outside the craft and you physically haul the soldier back to the craft and abort. Result: 0 pts, Soldier makes it back. Doesn't matter where the stunned soldier is on the craft. It can be in the backpack, in the hands, on the floor, wherever. The result is always the same).

And by the same token:

Stunned inside the craft and you abort. Result: 0 pts, and soldier makes it back to base.

 

For condition 3:

 

Stunned outside the craft and then blown up. Result: 0 pts, and soldier does not make it back to base.

Stunned inside the craft and then blown up. Result: 0 pts, and soldier does not make it back to base.

 

The only conclusion we can draw is that soldiers physically present in the landing craft (conscious or unconscious) at the time you abort are considered alive and recoverable. This makes sense because the same thing applies to any items on your craft when you abort.

 

----------

 

Gimli: would you care to explain the "warp thing in the Avenger"? Never heard of that before.

 

- Zombie

[Gimli]

You must first stand on the tile marked with the red square on the picture below. Then, assuming that the exit of the ship points in the north direction, you must click on the tile that is next to that one in the NW direction on the first floor, so through the wall of the ship, in the spot where the two walls connect.

 

https://upload.localnetsys.com/upload/november05/Avenger2.JPG

 

The soldier should go through there (make sure you don't have flying suit), and start falling (unless this was patched). Now in some cases, you will see a trace of the soldier while he is falling, like Enterprise when it's going to warp. Anyway it's quite funny.

 

I think it depends on the position of the screen view, so try moving it around. IIRC, if you move the screen so that the top of it is near the soldier, it should happen. Unfortunately, I don't have save with Avenger in my hands (the pic is from "Fight the human menace").

[Zombie]

Here is some more strange stuff I ran across today. Doors in an X-COM base will sometimes remain open forever, unless you open another door that same round. Strange but true. I always wondered why doors would suddenly stick "open". This may have to do with saving the game while a door is open, because when I run some trials without a save the doors shut on their own.

 

While running some of my psionic tests at a Sectoid alien base, I was killing off all the aliens except for the commander. Nothing really strange about that, but I finally came across another Sectoid with a Heavy Plasma stacked on the leg slot. Have a peek:

 

 

I think I figured out why it was stacked there. See the grenade in the Commanders hand? It was primed! That means it was getting ready to use a grenade against my men. In anticipation, it must have dumped the Heavy Plasma back into slot 0. You learn something new every day!

 

- Zombie

[Bomb Bloke]

In very rare cases, an alien will take control of one of your units, and do the same thing.

[Zombie]

There are probably a few variables which govern when an alien or an alien controlled unit will stack a weapon on a leg slot. The most important is mainly the lack of ammo for the weapon and the availability of a grenade of some sort sitting in slot 0. I have yet to figure out what these circumstances are, but I was able to replicate Bomb Blokes observation:

 

 

That's right, a Rocket Launcher stacked on the leg slot! Pretty easy to do: a weapon in the right hand, a grenade on the right leg slot, low psi skills and a bunch of soldiers grouped closely together to act as bait.

 

- Zombie

[NKF]

Well, basically any occasion where the alien needs to put the gun away. In this case, to use grenades. (Come to think of it, probably the only case)

 

Also, any alien carrying a mind probe will have the probe in the leg slot by default, as, the AI doesn't need to use the mind probe to know your stats.

 

I think you could replicate it with a mind controlled soldier by having the soldier carry a large object like a corpse, or an empty gun, and have another gun stored away. When the AI switches the empty object out for the weapon, you'll get the large object in the leg. No, wait, mind control an alien, stuff its heavy plasma in the backpack and have it pick up a corpse. Let it regain control and fire the gun once, and have a look. Voila, corpse taped to the leg.

 

- NKF

[Zombie]

Hehe, I went to visit a Large Scout today to do some more testing on stacking. Purpose? To see how much junk a Snakeman Soldier will squirrel away on his right leg slot. After a little bit of fooling around, this is what he looked like:

 

Hmmm... he looks innocent enough with a Heavy Plasma in his right hand and a Snakeman corpse on his leg.

 

But let's take a closer look to make sure.

 

Oh, wait. There's a Mind Probe on there! What else?

 

What?!?! A Heavy Plasma too? Come on. What else?

 

Finally! There's the corpse.

 

For my next trick I'm going to attempt to overencumber an alien by forcing it to stack stuff on it's leg till it can't move anymore!

 

Seriously though, there are a certain set of rules the AI follows to know how/when/where to stack. If an alien has a Mind Probe in the primary hand slot (right) and a Heavy Plasma in the other hand, it will shoot with it's off hand. The Mind Probe stays put. Let's keep the Mind Probe in the right hand and place an alien grenade on the left leg. What happens? The alien primes (and throws) the grenade with the left hand (with that now-famous shooting sound).

 

- Zombie

[Quantifier]

Yesterday I witnessed some illogically ordered checks and events in single geoscape loop.

 

I ordered an Interceptor to attack an UFO. Exactly the moment when my plane catched alien ship, they decided to land. When dogfight window appeared, on the globe there was already a green 'x'. Then, the UFO has outrunned my interception!

 

Alien racer?

[Bomb Bloke]

Pity you didn't manage to shoot it down...

[Alitorious]

Oh, yeah, I remember doing that before, only this time the interceptor was already engaged, but minimized, and I maximized it the exact time that it landed.

Maybe it's just "you think you're gonna land? Nuh-uh! Take Plasma Beams" or something....

Only that was with an Avenger... A UFO outrunning the interceptor on ground? Heh heh...

 

Was it a medium scout? Maybe it just landed on its side and just started rolling along realy fast?

[uriaheep]

This is a new one for me. I sent a small team to investigate a landing that was described as 'very small scout' and when I landed I found and killed a Muton. I asumed this to be a single occupant UFO but I could find no trace of any ship.

 

Is this new or has anyone seen similar?

[Zombie]

The small scout is very small and occupies (from memory) a 3x3x3 area. It is hard to miss. But no alien ship would be new to me too.

 

- Zombie

[JellyfishGreen]

The one-man scout is actually up on legs, and access is through a red lift square that brings you up into the belly. If you don't have all levels visible then maybe you only saw the legs or lift square on level 0 and didn't see the capsule on level 1.