Pumpkinhead Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 I have two questions about statistics: 1) I know this sort of thing has been asked before, but what I'd like to know is whether we have official numbers on all of a civilian's stats? 2) The OSG has the possible ranges of a new recruit's stats, but misses strength for some reason and was wondering if anyone knows what the possible range for a rookie's strength would be? For the record, here is what the OSG says:TUs: 50-60Stamina: 40-70Health: 25-40Strength: ??Bravery: 10-60Reactions: 30-60Firing Acc.: 40-70Throwing Acc.: 50-80Front Armour: 12L/R Armour: 8Rear Armour: 5Under Armour: 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 For the first time in a while, my game didn't crash, and I managed to get these results from several female civilians... Are they the same for all civilians? TUs: 35Stamina: 65Health: 30Bravery: 80Reactions: 30Firing Acc.: 30Throwing Acc.: 50Strength: 20Front Armour: 0L/R Armour: 0Rear Armour: 0Under Armour: 0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 Apart from a few cosmetic differences (and a difference in corpse weights), the male and female civilians are identical. However, what I would like you to consider is the difference in difficulty levels. Alien stats are adjusted based on the difficulty level, but I do not know if the same holds true for civilians. By the way, regarding starting stats, we discussed something about it in an earlier thread somewhere. I can't recall which one, but it was probably the one about determining reaction fire. It's fairly recent, so it's probably still on this or even the next page of threads. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 One other question: What is the Psi Strength of civilians? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 I would say 0. But that's just an assumption. But to find out for sure, I'll teach you an ancient ritual from ages long gone that will divine the knowledge that you seek. It requires that you have MS-Edit and that it can open files in binary mode. Windows 95, 98 and XP come standard issue with it. NT doesn't, apparently. Anyway, follow these steps: Save the game in the battlescape. Preferably a terror site to get your civilians. Exit the gameOpen up MS-Edit (for those that don't know, go to the command prompt and enter 'edit', or you can also do it from the run menu) Go to the savegame directory and select the file called unitref.datBefore opening, set it to open as binary and enter 124 as the line width. Select a line that belongs to a civilian (check near the far right edge of each line for the names)Move the cursor until the column number is 58 (check the status bar)Read the 'value' line in the status bar. You'll have found the unit's psi-strength.You could use a hex editor, but I find it's easier to browse the unit table in MS-Edit. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 Sweet! I'll give that a go... I tried opening another file in edit the other day but must not have selected binary because it came up with lots of weird symbols :dontgetit: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 Okay I tried it and it didn't work... When I open it as binary there are no names at all... I can however, open it in MS Word 2000 and see the names, but have no data after them, just funny squares :dontgetit: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 As I said, the names are all the way on the right edge of each row. The console and MS-Edit can only show 80 (well, 78) columns across, but the column width for each entry is set to 124. Just hit 'end' to send the cursor all the way to the right, and you should see the names. If all you got were funny symbols, then that's good! Unless the entries are in plain text, you're going to have to read the values in the status bar. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 10, 2004 Author Share Posted February 10, 2004 Thanks, dude, it worked fine The value was 5 for anyone interested... Do you have a list of what each column represents? I tried figuring out my own, but it has huge gaps... and bravery seems to be missing :dontgetit: Also, TUs, Health, Stamina, Reactions, and armour are repeated, which I found rather odd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Bravery's actually stored slightly differently. I think it was 110 - (10 * x), with x being what's stored in each record. I've pieced together a fairly comprehensive list of what each field represents (fairly being the key-word), but for a variety of reasons, would prefer not to disclose it to the public. (just to save my bottom from any form of righteous legal retribution) As for the double values, some of the stats represent the maximum values and the other represents the current values. Not all the current values are stored in the save file, and are calculated on the spot. Please note that most of all the stats in the unitref file are temporary. Apart from a few stats (like health and the experience), changes to your soldier's stats in this file will not affect the records in soldier.dat. I'm planning to make a simple command line utility to display all the information of a particular unit in the battlescape (and display all sorts of interesting information such as the current experience, and what sort of shots the soldier will be able to do with the current equipped weapon, etc)- but I'm still working out how all the files interact with each other, so it's going to be quite some time. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 10, 2004 Author Share Posted February 10, 2004 Another thing I found interesting is that civilians' height is 21 and X-COM soldiers' as 22, which makes them taller than everything save the Reaper and Sectopod Ps - I've only figured out columns 13-34, 38, 40, 45, 50, 57-59, 74... and the obviously the names Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Well, I see you're having a bit of fun. (you'll also be pleased to know that you found what looks to be the height stat before I did. I take it you're referring to column 50?) I'll leave you to it then. We can compare notes later. (via the PM, preferably) - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkinhead Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 Yep, column 50 it was I've also got 43, 77 and 79 now too I think my list now has most of the important stuff but I'd still like to know what the rest of the data means Let's just say, if I was a cat, I would have died long ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Well, I finally completed my table on the possible values a new recruit can have. If you remember I only had a short list of 200 soldiers a while back. It now stands at 1000. Here it is: ----AVERAGE---- STATISTIC MIN MAX RANGE MEDIAN MODE ANTIC. ACTUAL STD DEV Time Units 50 60 11 55 56 55 54.75 3.16 Stamina 40 70 31 54 47 55 54.43 8.95 Health 25 40 16 32 28/30 32.5 32.35 4.52 Bravery 10 60 6 30 30 35 34.94 17.18 Reactions 30 60 31 44 32 45 44.82 9.21 Firing Acc. 40 70 31 55 48 55 54.69 8.62 Throw Acc. 50 80 31 64 50 65 64.73 9.08 Strength 20 40 21 30 28/35 30 30.11 5.84 Psi Str. 0 100 101 51 60 50 50.42 29.24 Psi Skill 16 24 9 20 19 20 20.12 2.54 Actually, there are very few differences in this table from the one with only 200 soldiers. The most noteable changes are in the Actual Average, the Median, and obviously the Mode. I also revised the Range data which is (Max-Min+1) - I forgot that these are inclusive numbers! Since there were only minor changes between the 200 and 1000 soldier lists, I decided that 1000 values were sufficient. I would have been fully prepared to increase the size of the list if necessary, but this was (luckily) not the case. If one were to add more values, the greatest change would be in the Mode data, especially with the Health, Strength and Psionic Strength statistics. This is because there is a linear distribution among the numbers possible in that stat. There would also be small changes associated with the Actual Average, Median and Standard Deviation. For this discussion I think these numbers will suffice. On page 104 of X-COM Strategies and Secrets by Neil Randall, the author states that soldiers with the first name of Maria seem to have above-average statistics, and backs up this claim with one soldier having TU=60, STA=67, HE=40, BR=30, RE=60, FA=61, TA=52, and STR=37. I kept track of soldiers with the name of Maria in my 1000 soldier data and found that there is absolutely no difference between the average soldier and a Maria. The Maria's tended to fall somewhat BELOW average in most statistics! I guess Mr. Randall got the luck of the draw and received an above average soldier named Maria and unfortunately formed an invalid conclusion from a too-small sample size. Please note : these numbers were gathered from my two versions of the game (PC-CE and PSX) which have identical soldier stats (I checked). There are a few different PC versions of X-COM so some values may be incorrect in your game, especially the european release. The only way to tell is to gather a list of 200 soldiers and check for yourself. By the way: those civilian stats are correct, and there is no difference between males and females except for the weight as NKF pointed out. So the Psionic Strength of a civilian is 5, correct? What is the Psionic Skill? 0? Here is a question: what is the Psionic Skill of a HWP? I believe the Psionic Strength is 100 like the alien robots. I always assumed the Skill is also the same (0). Can anyone find out, because I would really like to know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 27, 2004 Share Posted February 27, 2004 Correct, HWPs have 100 psi strength, and 0 skill. If you cannot see the psi strength of a unit, then its psi-skill is definitely 0. Interesting note about HWPs - the shape of the HWP's chassis is determined by their rank. If the tank is a rookie, it's a tracked tank. If it's a squaddie, its outward apperance is that of a hover tank. Not much of an improvement, but it's an interesting tidbit some of you might make use of. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ki-tat Chung Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 what, so all the programmers do is change the "rank"? and one other question about the tanks: can the fire go through the hole in the tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Well, the look of the tank's body is determined by the rank. The abilities, like flight, armour, turret image, etc, are determined elsewhere. As for the next bit, I don't quite follow you. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattler Posted February 28, 2004 Share Posted February 28, 2004 Are you talking about the Displacer Tank from TFTD? That has a hole that goes through it and I'm pretty sure bullets and what not does go through it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombie Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Sorry about the necromancy, but I have been doing some research in X-COM to clear up some questions. It's surprising that I even remembered this thread! Anyway, NKF asked this a while back:However, what I would like you to consider is the difference in difficulty levels. Alien stats are adjusted based on the difficulty level, but I do not know if the same holds true for civilians. - NKFI was messing around in the Beginner and Experienced difficulty levels the other day and decided to check out civie stats. There is no difference in a civilians stats as the difficulty changes. And like it was mentioned, Males and Females have the same numbers too (except for the weights). Here is a list of the values:Time Units: 35Stamina: 65Health: 30Bravery: 80Reactions: 30Firing Accuracy: 30Throwing Accuracy: 50Strength: 20Psionic Strength: 5Psionic Skill: 0Front Armor: 0L/R Armor: 0Rear Armor: 0Under Armor: 0 - Zombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomb Bloke Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Weights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NKF Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Yes, the male civilian weighs 30 units, while the female civilian weighs 50 units. Of course, we don't really notice this because the civilian corpse never shows up in the inventory screen, so we can't pick it up. - NKF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomb Bloke Posted September 2, 2005 Share Posted September 2, 2005 Ah, you mean the ITEMS... Technically speaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stun Grenade Posted September 3, 2005 Share Posted September 3, 2005 If you can't pick them up then how do you measure their mass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomb Bloke Posted September 3, 2005 Share Posted September 3, 2005 By reading through the datafiles of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobbes Posted September 7, 2005 Share Posted September 7, 2005 Yes, the male civilian weighs 30 units, while the female civilian weighs 50 units. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Useful notice for X-COM agents: don't ask for a date any surviving females from a Terror Site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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