Help with turn-based bachelor thesis?

[Slaughter]

Summary:

I'm writing a bachelor thesis on the commercial aspects of turn-based games in the 21st century. If you think you can offer me any assistance, please read the rest of the post.

 

Turn-based bachelor thesis:

I'm about to write my bachelor thesis, and I've chosen the following subject:

 

"Development and Publishing - Turn-based games in the 21st Century?"

 

As it is an economics bachelor, I'll focus on the commercial aspects of turn-based games.

 

To help me write this thesis, I'd like to gather as much feedback from developers and publishers as possible. I will probably send them two short interview, where one or both of them has a set of standardised questions. In addition I hope that some of them might be willing to share market examinations with me, and other information they might have on the turn-based market. I have "contacts" in the following:

 

Developers:

ALTAR Games

Chaos Concept

Codo

Funcom

Mist land - South

Nival Interactive

Silver Style

 

Publishers:

Atari

Cenega Publishing

JoWooD

Tri Synergy

Ubisoft

 

I'd like to get information from as many publishers and developers as possible, even if they haven't done anything turn-based. To make this easier for me, I'd like to ask the community here for help.

 

If you know people with publishers / developers that might be willing to answer some questions, and could put me in touch with them, I'd really appreciate it. Please make sure you ask them before providing me with any contact details, as I don't want to annoy or spam them. If they are okay with it, please contact me through PM or lognvik(at)hotmail(dot)com. Use "Turn-based thesis" as subject, to make sure I don't delete it as spam. It doesn't matter if the publisher / developer are already in my list, as I'd appreciate multiple opinions from the same developer / publisher.

 

The second thing I need is good sources of information on the commercial aspects of turn-based games. This could be anything from sales stats on turn-based games to contact with people that knows a lot about the subject. I'd also appreciate any advice the community might provide.

 

In addition to these things, suggestions on methods of collecting data and anything else you might think useful are welcome.

 

Possible turn-based information resource:

In addition to writing the thesis itself, I consider building a small turn-based resource site from my findings. It would contain:

- All the developer / publisher interviews.

- Useful web resources on the subject.

- Literature recommendations on the subject.

- Recommendations on turn-based games.

- Possibly some news and forums.

- My findings, and possibly others.

 

Alternatively I might add it to StrategyCore.co.uk. Either way, this depends on how much useful information I manage to gather.

 

Contact:

Personal Message

lognvik(at)hotmail(dot)com with the subject "Turn-based thesis"

Through Linkedin

 

Thanks you in advance for your assistance!

[Krabjuice]

By no means limit yourself to computer turnbased games. Since the 50's and eariler, tabletop gaming has been a successful industry.

 

Speaking of which: what, specificly, is your argument?

[Slaughter]

By no means limit yourself to computer turnbased games. Since the 50's and eariler, tabletop gaming has been a successful industry.

 

Speaking of which: what, specificly, is your argument?

I'll focus on computer turn-based games. Tabletop games are relevant to the subject as well however, so I'll follow your advice and look into them. Thanks!

 

What do you mean argument? Why did I choose this subject?

[Thorondor]

@Olav:

 

"Tabletop games are relevant to the subject as well however, (...)"

 

Now that you mention it, a particularly interesting mix of tabletop-gone-online-turn-based game *pants * can be found in Wizards of the Coast's popular "Magic The Gathering Online".

 

::

 

It's a strong turn-based strategy game that sports a surprisingly effective, and fairly uncommon, business model in the multiplayer segment.

 

If you decide to check it out, a good starting place would be this late January analysis of its upcoming 3.0 incarnation at GameSpy.

[Slaughter]

Yeah, thanks Thor . I'm a seasoned Magic player (cards that is), and spent WAY too much money on it in "the old days". I'll take a look, as I noticed there was a preview in the news at Blue's today as well.

[Bomb Bloke]

I used one deck for many years... Flames of Wrath, rwoar!

[Krabjuice]

What do you mean argument? Why did I choose this subject?

 

Well, since you probably won't be basing your assigment utterly on presenting nifty little facts and statistics that you've gathered, you're going to be making a point. We start doing that after grade 8. The question is: what point are you trying to make, what opinion are you trying to argue into credibility?

[Slaughter]

I'll explore the commercial aspects of turn-based games. Are they still in demand for the PC, or is it a dying system? How about handhelds? Do publishers believe that there is still a turn-based market? What do their market analysis say? What about developers?

 

So what I'm trying to find out is whether there is a market for turn-based games in the 21st century. I'm trying to make a point of the facts. So far it looks like the turn-based PC games has a bleak future, while the handhelds are going strong.

[JellyfishGreen]

I can't give you any inside tips, Slaughter, but I see the resurgence on the hand-helds too. eg Paths of Glory on my NGage is one of the big hits for the little platform. At a guess, I would say the good turn-based games offer good gameplay despite the lower resolution on a handheld; but since PC's have continually been increasing in high graphic resolution and processing power, they can now afford to offer real-time, graphically intense gameplay with FPS's and other real-time simulations (FIFA Soccer, Rainbow 6...). Back in the 80's and 90's, turn-based was more popular because the real-time games were crude - remember very-low-poly 3D games like Elite and Battlezone?

[Accounting Troll]

Slaughter, are you hoping that by getting us to type out replies, all you need to do is a spot of copy and paste?

 

The fact that the UFO series is going to a third instalment and all those fan based X-Com remakes suggests that there is still a market. Don't forget that the North American marketing for the UFO series was bungled.

 

I think the "professional" reviewers are a major factor in putting developers and publishers off from turn based games. If the reviews of Aftershock are anything to go by, reviewers are biased in favour of fast paced, graphics heavy action and sport games that you can get into in about ten minutes. I don't think any professional reviewer played Aftershock through to the end, or even the mid-point.

 

EDIT: you've frequently complained about the standard of professional reviews, so think how much fun it will be to review the reviewers! Examine the Aftershock reviews and see how many mention mid-game features like the new alien races. Having some data to back up you assertion always impresses.

 

Publishers tend to be conservative and they will only stump up the cash for a new game if they are certain that it will be a financial success, therefore developers end up grunting out the sort of game that appeals to a reviewer who doesn't want to spend more than an hour playing the game before he writes the review so he can get off home early. The fact that the American economy in particular has been in recession in recent years has tended to increase this trend.

 

I can't help noticing how the modern turn-based games seem to be developed in former Warsaw Pact countries, so it would be interesting to compare the situation in North America with Western Europe, Eastern Europe and the Pacific Rim. Perhaps the European market is stronger than the North American market for this sort of game? Your asessors will almost certainaly expect you to consider this question as in the business world, knowing whether you should concentrate on the European market and regard America as a side show is vital.

 

I believe the potential market for turn based strategy games is as strong and lucrative as ever, but there needs to be a new marketing strategy that does not depend on getting good reviews from the sort of professional reviewer who prefers arcade games and getting home early on a Friday

[Slaughter]

@JellyfishGreen: Yes, I think that is very true. I'm currently playing Advance Wars on my DS, and it's obvious that graphics isn't the selling point . I've blamed graphics for the decay in gameplay for years. Ever since 3d first started coming, developers and publishers completely lost focus. Now it's starting to improve again, because "everyone" can produce nice graphics, but it's been a long period of pitiful excuses for a game.

 

@Troll: Yes, geography and culture definitively has something to do with it in my opinion. Turn-based games are very popular in Russia for instance, and I believe that has to do with several factors: Their lower general PC specs (connected to the handheld arguments JellyfishGreen presented above), longer attention spans (patience) and other cultural factors. I'll have to explore this closer of course, but I think it is so. Reviews reflect this as well I believe, if you check the average by geographical area.

[FullAuto]

The Japanese also have a deep relationship with TB games. Disgaea: Hour of Darkness and La Pucelee: Tactics are both recent examples of the genre. Both from the same company (Nippon Ichi), both excellent games.

 

Square did the Front Mission series, mech-themed TB games that kick enormous amounts of arse. Not forgetting Final Fantasy Tactics.

 

Konami made Vandal Hearts (possibly the first TB RPG for the PlayStation) and also Ring of Red.

 

I even remember playing TB games for the SNES, stuff like Ogre Battle, Super Famicom Wars (predecessor of the Advance Wars series) and Romance of the Three Kingdoms.

 

Generally they have strong fantasy or sci-fi themes, as well as RPG elements to involve you more with the story and characters than some Western games which are just straight-up war simulations (SSI's Panzer General for example, although please note SSI went on to make Fantasy General). Of course, it may just be because the West has been involved in more wars recently, or it may just be an issue of escapism. Perhaps it's because the Japanese lost, and they don't wish to relive what happened in even the most artificial ways? There may be a comparable situation in Germany today.

[Zombie]

Konami made Vandal Hearts (possibly the first TB RPG for the PlayStation) and also Ring of Red.

Just to interject here, Vandal Hearts came out in 1997 for the PlayStation. I believe that the distinction of the first turn-based RPG for the PlayStation belongs to none other than X-COM. It came out 25 October 1995, less than two months after the initial release of the PlayStation console in the United States (9 September 1995). Not that this matters much, but being first in a category is always impressive.

 

- Zombie

[FullAuto]

Although obviously turn-based strategy, X-Com isn't an RPG.

[Thorondor]

I've bumped into an interesting comment from StarDock personnel that should prove right up your alley thesis-wise, Olav

 

Here's the link.

 

::

 

Turn-based; dead ? Indeed... *snorts*

[Slaughter]

Thanks for the heads up Thorondor! Guess it's a bit early to celebrate just yet for them, but a good sign it is! I sure hope they'll give me a hand when I approach them!

[Thorondor]

@Slaughter:

 

"I sure hope they'll give me a hand when I approach them!"

 

*crosses fingers*

 

::

 

Pages on GalCiv2.com are loading somewhat slowly at this time (which isn't so surprising given the flood of hits they're getting) but you can read an update on goings-on (retail, etc.) here.

 

 

p.s.: oh, and a word to the wise, Olav - StarDock seemingly has contact with Firaxis as can be verified in this snip I've came across

 

"Apparently the mouse issue isn't specific to GalCiv II so I'll probably shoot an email over to our friends at Firaxis to see what they've seen on this."

 

So much for 'monkey business'...

 

p.p.s.: just discovered an inside scoop on Altarian origins at IGN

 

"(...) you see, the Drath's home world was once Altaria, which long ago was home to two sentient species; over time, the Altarians became dominant and the Drath were forced into hiding. An individual Drath is strong, intelligent and ruthless, but the Drath simply lacked the numbers and had to give way to the growing biomass of the Altarians. Through centuries of living in the shadows, the Drath honed their skills of espionage, destabilization and manipulation. Then one day, the Drath somehow-in a way that remains a mystery-managed to escape Altaria and go to the planet now called Drath (here we should point out the obvious: before coming to live on Drath, these beings considered themselves the true natives of Altaria, Altarians)."

[ source ]

[Thorondor]

@Slaughter:

 

I'm "kinda" on a roll with StarDock right now. Here's another pearl from GCII's FAQ:

 

"Q: Why turn-based? The most popular strategy games these days are real-time.

 

Because it's a viable market that is currently underserved. There are millions of gamers out there who want to sit down and really think out their overall strategy and not feel rushed."

::

 

We are certainly fortunate there are people out there that still have the heart and insight to dedicate themselves to the development of quality TB titles that crest the wave and shake publishers out of their deadpan RTS whirlpool...

[Thorondor]

@Slaughter:

 

"Economics in Gaming II", GalCivII style. Link to part I provided in-article.

 

::

 

Talk about making it easy for you, Olav - already they deserve a treat...

[Slaughter]

Hehe, thanks!