"That's the last time I leave you in charge!"

[NKF]

Nothing wrong, the pistols. Very fine weapons. Pity they can't punch through very heavy armour -- which is exactly what the Mutons have. Bad combination there.

 

Did you have any of the alien weapons researched by then? If you did, you could have made it if you managed to pick some of them up off fallen enemies, probably even the blaster.

 

- NKF

[Jman4117]

Very little researched. Think I had the laser weapons and alien alloys and medkits. Hadn't got to alien weaponry.

[The Demi-Godly One]

Mutons are weak to regular grenades. Relatively.

[EclipseDog]

The worst mission I ever had, was a few months ago, when I simply moved a laser tank out of the Skyranger and ended the turn, and a blaster bomb just shot right into the ramp.  It was a rookie squad, with no armor.  Everyone died.  So I reloaded to see what the hell happened, and a couple map squares over in a grass area was a Muton Engineer with a blaster launcher.  Damn him.

I've had the same thing happen as Fox stated in an earlier post on this thread I think... except whatever it was that hit my squad when I moved my tank out one square did so with reaction fire rather than during their turn. I never even got a chance to see what the heck it was they hit me with or who the heck it was I was assaulting. I already had posted about this on a different thread before realizing this thread was the same subject only more recent, so I'll simply requote myself from that other thread.

 

I'm returning life to this extremely old thread since I've got a one-upper story over most of those.

 

It was an assault on a medium sized ship that had landed already. Since this was in the early days I had 10 troops and 1 HWP on my sky1.

 

I took one step onto the ramp with my HWP when out of nowhere an alien reaction fire comes in from straight ahead.

 

Not only does it blow up my tank, it also kills everyone but the 1 trooper in the far back-right corner of the plane, only leaving smoking black smears in about a 10x6 pattern and turning the outside of my plane into a blackened but still perfectly sound version of itself.

 

Naturally the reason that guy was in the back of the plane was that he was pathetic. He panics and runs forward like a blooming idiot... right into more reaction fire. Sure this time it was only a single shot rather than an explosion... didn't matter though since I had no one left conscious/alive.

 

 

Mission ends and all I managed to do was take 1 step. Hell didn't even get a chance to abort, which really su... err inhaled.

 

:hmmm:

[Veers]

Worst mission ever was when I had a rookie in the elite team.

Fist the fist to men did go out of the skyranger and did get shot strait down and the nexst to was send out to be cannon fodder. then I did wait a turn, bad move. the rooke in the theam had rocket luncher armed whead HE rocked, BANG down to 2 men in the back inn panick and nexst round they did of the wonds. after that no big guns to the rookie. The worst part was it was a no save game.

[Rosstoid]

My worst mission was my most recent finishing of the game.

 

I hand-picked my soldiers for their bravery and general length of stat bars. I didn't play that game of X-Com with any PSI at all, believing it to take the tactics out of the game. But also because capturing sectoid leaders and ethereals is difficult.

 

14 soldiers, 2 plasma tanks and 1 blaster tank went in. Getting into the elevator pyramid was easy. When I got into the base complex it was okay at first but soon the ethereals started taking an interest in the minds of the soldiers. I pushed them forward and a soldier was killed in the exchange of small arms fire. A big blow was struck when a blaster bomb killed the super elite commander, a blaster bomb soldier and a plasma tank. A grenade killed 3 soldiers. Another blaster bomb blew up a soldier and a plasma tank. The soldiers started panicking and getting mind controlled. 3 soldiers panicked and 2 mind controlled soldiers shot them. A bolt of alien plasma put the blaster bomb tank out of commision, leaving me to deal with the brain face on. One soldier dodged mind control and enemy shots and reached the chamber where 4 ethereals were waiting. He dodged a shot, hit the brain and I had won. Only he and another soldier survived (although he would have died soon after by the ethereals).

[knight]

started a new campain and intercepted first craft (small scout)

 

a full skyranger emptyeid out troops in close fire positions and ended first turn

 

sectoid wallkec out from between hedge and threw a grenade right into my troops killing all but two

 

those two died two turns later due to a rookie grenade acident

 

restarted the campain after that

[Specter]

Very early in the game. This was the kind of situation you pray you don't get.

 

A terror ship strikes in Novisbirsk. By the time I get there it is, ofcourse, around midnight.

 

Upon opening the hatch one of my HW people comes out and turns to examin the area, to the left there are 3! of those hovering plasma tanks. (Cyberdiscs?) Luckily the first person off the boat had a rocket launcher. I targeted the nearest sectoid and fired a snapshot. The sound of screaming civs rang through the night as I cringed. The rocket had gone through the window of the gas station and killed a civ or 2. I ran my HW guy behind teh landing gear of the Skyranger and brought out 2 auto cannons loaded with HE ammo. One instant of FF killed 2 men and I was able to destroy one after 2 full salvos from the ACs. I began pulling my people out of the Ship and taking shot after shot at the tanks. I killed 2...

 

Next turn I have lost 4 more people. Not only to the tank, but to sectoids on the other side. The rocketlauncher person I mentioned at the beginning took a shot at the plasmadisc and reloaded, killing the last one.

 

I turn around and start duking it out with the sectoids, there are 2 of them. I kill them. All seems well. Next round, that missle launcher you should know by now was MCed... close range, my people were grouped.. I had 3 survivors that I sent to the Skyranger. After retreating I reloaded.

[NCC-1701-F]

One time, first month of the game, terror site.... I'm in the center of the map, bottom edge. Left of the skyranger is a warehouse, in front of it another warehouse. Above the skyranger is a road and then a HUGE park/open area covering half the map. All of my guys were packing a normal rifle, an extra clip plus grenades and so on... I also had a medic and an explosives man. I step out of the skyranger, bam 2 sectoids standing right there, took them out but lost a man (no armor yet). Then i've got my troops fanning out and in the park i spot a sectoid on one side and 2 or 3 cyberdiscs on the other, plus i've got other bugs in/near the warehouses cutting off reinforcements/retreat for the guys in the park. The only thing i have that can touch the cyberdiscs is the high explosive packs........ i won.............after 2 hours (real time)......... with one survivor. Not fun

[kai]

Worst mission for me was a TFTD one. Mission 1, large scout ship equiv. Lost well over half the team before evantually aborting.

 

And then again there is the important base I llost. All my stuff was there

[EtherImp]

I hate when they throw terror missions at you first thing.. Especially Sectiod. Cyberdisk are a bitch to take down with rifles. Any starting weapon lighter than a rocket launcher has a hard time with them.. And rocket launchers usually need to hit it almost dead on. And, I usually only carry a max of 4 rockets.. Usually 1 small 2 large 1 IC.

[kai]

Lots of grenades, that helps

[bevan]

Start Infiltration going awesome compared to loadout vs enemy:

Well i had a mission that went about every way possible. Decided to attack a base i found in the first few months. Brought 2 Heavy Cannons with 2 HE clips and an AP clip each. The other 6 soldiers had Laser Rifles and Stun Rods. All soldiers had a Medikit, Alien Grenade and normal Grenade. I rock up to the base and when i get down the Grav Lifts i find a Mutton with his back turned. It is wasted with a few blasts and then next turn i find a Mutton behind me, reaction fire misses me and then i took him down with a HC-HE shot and lasers. Walking up from the lifts next trun I find a Mutton with his back turned, which then took 3 laser shots from right next to it, downing it.

 

Things start to turn sour:

Next turn a Silacoid is seen across from grav lifts near an entrance to a big plant block. A HC and laser kill it and stir up some crazed Muttons which charge at me over the next few turns. Kill about 2 Muttons which start at me whilst im travelling up and down the grav lifts for cover, losing one Laser. Next turn another mutton is right near the grav lift used for cover, drop an armed alien gren on the corpse of my HC person which explodes causing no damage to anything except my man's remains. when i drop down the lift I bail to where my other people were clearing. Shot in the back on the aliens turn.

 

Making the best of a bad situation:

My laser weilding soldiers were performing a search and destroy in 3 teams of 2 (not enough for killing muttons with lasers). Enter a disco room with a purple floor and flashy walls and shoot and kill a Mutton on the far end. Two teams had entered the room by the next turn, lost one to enemy plasma. Alien turn takes two of those men, leaving three all up. XCOM turn sees an alien shot but still kicking and a plasma bolt which darkened that area.

 

The almighty comeback:

My last two men go postal, HC going into the funky plant room and running into two muttons at point blank. Leave the Stun Bomb Mutton and shoot the one with the plasma behind him. BOOM thuds into the wall behind the Mutton, a plasma bolt misses the soldier (My Captain), BOOM, hits the mutton who then zapped my man. Last soldier runs into a Mutton and nails him with laser fire. Swapping of guns leads to my man running up and taking plasma in the chest before killing a green on the side of the Command Post. Sticking to the wall he heads round to the door. His two auto fire shots kill the 2 greens in front of the door but receives another blow. Heading into the CP he finds and executes another guard around the inner corridor. Getting inside he lobs a gren through the roof and watches the fireworks from the grav lift. Goes up next turn and finds the room empty. Next turn he is shot at and when he nails a green at the bottom of the lift takes another shot. By this point im glad he is still kicking (not even a critical wound but still missing a bit of health). Dispatches the last Mutton and is shunted off home.

 

That was an awesome mission which got my heart going like a jackhammer in my chest.

[Jasonred]

Worst Mission: Terrorist Ethereals. BLASTED SECTOPODS!!!

 

I had SOME advanced weapons, but... still couldn't really punch through their blasted armor in Superhuman. I mean, it's bad enough on normal, but double armored Sectopods???

 

Killed everything in sight, then realised that NOTHING in my arsenal was capable of killing those walking tanks.

 

Lost a few men and tanks before dusting off.

 

NEXT TIME AROUND: Just as bad misssion: When I went for vengeance on another group of Sectopods, having Hyperwave decoder, I being forewarned went in with Heavy Lasers, Laser Rifles, and Heavy Plasma.

 

... The heck??? Shots practically bouncing off, even against rear armor!

 

Turns out only the LASER TANK has enough power among the laser weapons to off those things in one hit (if lucky). Or a mind controlled Sectopod . Or... Blaster Launchers.

 

BTW, why are the Tanks' Fusion Balls and Plasma weaker than Soldier's Blaster Launcher and Heavy Plasma?

[NKF]

I thought the plasma tank's turret was just as powerful - the accuracy is a fault of the tank's base accuracy itself. The turret is great, the tank isn't.

 

As for the fusion ball tank - well, it does what it needs to do, but I guess when you compare the elerium requirements and the resulting boom, it just doesn't add up.

 

---

 

As for the sectopods, you could try using the small launcher on them. On easier levels, multiple sectopods can collapse after one or two hits. On superhuman, due to the higher armour, the chance of actually knocking one out is a lot lower (and you can't knock out multiple sectopods anymore) - but it's better than trying to endlessly pummel at them with a heavy laser (and if you've been collecting but not using all those hundreds of stun bombs - it's a great way to get rid of them).

 

The heavy plasma seems to do a fair job - mainly because it has auto-fire so you get a lot more tries on the same turn than the heavy laser.

 

This one's a bit of a cheat when used in this manner: But, you can also try the incendiary damage trick where all units standing in fire will receive damage from any incendiary detonation - no matter where the detonation occurs. Use the autocannon - the damage levels only control the blast radius and not the damage, and you want to keep the amount of fire patches down to a minimum to avoid the fire/smoke limit. So if you see multiple sectopods, try to set fire to as many as you can, and as you're doing so, the sectopods that were previously set on fire will continually take damage. I know it works on easier levels - and I'm sure I've tested it with superhuman armour sectopods, but give it a go if you've got some spare time and see if it works for you.

 

- NKF

[Jasonred]

So... how about dealing with Sectopods when you FIRST meet them on Superhuman. Which is pretty darn early on some occasions, I might add. Any recommendations how to deal with them then? Research Sturn Bomb and small launcher ASAP and use THOSE as my arsenal early game?

 

With the armor on those things, plus the insane amounts of life, even 4x "burn" damage isn't going to stop it from sending half a squad to the morgue, what with high accuracy auto fire energy cannon and all. At least, that's what's happening to me.

 

Heavy Plasmas don't work well on it on Superhuman. I tested it out by saving and burst firing into one's rear, then kept reloading for test results. High armor+ resistance to Plasma = barely any damage done per hit, even to rear armor.

 

BTW, could you explain how fire damage is calculated? The whole "initial hit, splash damage, on fire, standing on fire" process seems to confuse me.

[NKF]

Early on? Simple: Run.

 

High explosives and large rockets do work, albeit not as quickly as you'd hope them to.

 

Incendiary effects do damage in two ways. Impact damage, then continuous fire damage over several turns. The damage listed in the ufopaedia only controls how big the patch of fire will be - not impact damage or the continuous damage.

 

I don't recall what the impact damage dealt, but I think it's somewhere around 0 - 10 damage. Not much, I'll grant you that. But, what makes it truly unique is that impact damage is dealt to every unit that is standing in fire - anywhere on the map, regardless of where the incendiary shell explodes.

 

You can test this by setting fire to the ground, then having a soldier or two stand in it. Then immediately fire off a few incendiary rounds at some other location in the map. When they hit and explode, check the health of your test subjects. Health will have dropped.

 

Now, let's take another scenario. We have five targets and we fire incendiary rounds at each unit in sequence. After five hits, target 1 will have been hit 5 times, target 2 will be hit 4 times, target 3 will be hit 3 times, target 4 will be hit 2 times and target 5 will be hit only once.

 

Make sense? If not, just run the above test and see the effects for yourself. (Do the tests with flying suits - it's not as good as sectopod armour, but it's close enough)

 

- NKF

[Zombie]

How do you deal with Sectopods early-on? If you are on any skill level higher than beginner, the Sectopod's armor is double. That makes it twice as hard to kill. But what is a good strategy?

 

Like NKF said, high explosives in general work, but slower than you would hope. Actually, HE are the only weapon type that will impart a minimum damage greater than 0. That's the good news. Every shot that connects slowly wears away at the target until it is dead. The bad news is that the Sectopod is 80% susceptible to high explosives. Even so, because the Sectopod is a 2x2 terror unit, the damage imparted by HE is almost triple what a normal 1x1 unit would take. Can you say "area effect"?

 

The same thing goes for stun. While the stun bomb is not entirely an area effect ammunition, it comes close. Lasers are also excellent choices. The 150% susceptibility rating really ups the damage dealt.

 

The Heavy Plasma can only manage to pump out a maximum of 1.6 times its listed damage. Therefore, a Superhuman Sectopod requires a minimum of two HP shots in the rear to kill. Frontal attacks with HP require a minimum of 4 shots. That's the best case scenario. In actuality, 79% of all Heavy Plasma shots to the front plates will not harm the Sectopod. This means that only 21% of your Heavy Plasma shots will do some damage.

 

Is there an appropriate weapon type for dealing with Sectopods? No. But combinations of the different types may prove to be useful. Soften the Sectopod up with Laser and Plasma first, then dump some High Explosives on it before your turn ends. If that doesn't kill it outright, some stun bombs could knock it out.

 

Gang up on a Sectopod with multiple soldiers and Laser Tanks. That's the best advice I can give if you have to fight them. If you don't have the necessary firepower, there is nothing wrong with aborting!

[Stun Grenade]

Interesting to hear about the 'difficulty' in the game, changes some values around...

 

My motto is this:

If its big, have a dig

If its small, there shall be no brawl

 

So basically weaken sectopods and then finish em off works most the time. But half the time they always fire back at me...

 

PS: motto was made on spot and im quite aware of its cornyness..

[Jasonred]

I personally found it more than a little annoying how Laser Rifles on auto-burst in the rear went from killing most of the time to... almost no damage on Superhuman. grr!!! (usually no damage in fact)

 

In fact, even my heavy laser were usually doing zero damage to those sectopods, I think. (didn't have mind probe so didn't check)

 

Even on Superhuman though, a sectopod's auto-fire IS guaranteed to down a sectopod. mmm...

[Zombie]

I personally found it more than a little annoying how Laser Rifles on auto-burst in the rear went from killing most of the time to... almost no damage on Superhuman. grr!!! (usually no damage in fact)

Laser Rifles will pump out an average of 90 damage points against a Sectopod. Since the Superhuman Sectopod's rear armor rating is 100, that 90 average points isn't enough to breach its rear armor. In fact, only 44% of your Laser Rifle shots would be effective against it's rear plates.

 

In fact, even my heavy laser were usually doing zero damage to those sectopods, I think. (didn't have mind probe so didn't check)

Heavy Lasers have an average damage of 120 against Sectopods. That's enough to breach their armor and reduce it's health 58% of the time. The Heavy Laser is so powerful against a Sectopod that you should witness insta-kills in 8% of it's shots. Not to shabby!

 

Even on Superhuman though, a sectopod's auto-fire IS guaranteed to down a sectopod. mmm...

Actually, a Sectopod is partially resistant to it's own weapon! A Sectopod's weapon can deal 80 average points of damage against itself. And that isn't enough to punch through it's rear armor. Here again, the Sectopod's own weapon will only be able to damage itself 37% of the time (assuming you can target the rear plates). With a 3 shot-burst, one of them is bound to punch through though.

[Jasonred]

Laser Rifles will pump out an average of 90 damage points against a Sectopod. Since the Superhuman Sectopod's rear armor rating is 100, that 90 average points isn't enough to breach its rear armor. In fact, only 44% of your Laser Rifle shots would be effective against it's rear plates.

 

BTW, what's the best spot to aim at to "target" it's rear in close quarters? With 4 squares to it, I've noticed some of my shots damaging it's side armor despite running behind one and unloading point blank.

Actually, 44% ain't too bad, since with burst fire, it's likely the first or second shot would penetrate, reducing the armor, and the 3rd shot does more damage.

 

Heavy Lasers have an average damage of 120 against Sectopods. That's enough to breach their armor and reduce it's health 58% of the time. The Heavy Laser is so powerful against a Sectopod that you should witness insta-kills in 8% of it's shots. Not to shabby! 

 

The trouble is, without auto fire, it usually hits them, and they spin around and return fire, so only the first shot hits REAR armor. Front armor is... 145, isn't it?

 

 

Actually, a Sectopod is partially resistant to it's own weapon! A Sectopod's weapon can deal 80 average points of damage against itself. And that isn't enough to punch through it's rear armor. Here again, the Sectopod's own weapon will only be able to damage itself 37% of the time (assuming you can target the rear plates). With a 3 shot-burst, one of them is bound to punch through though. 

 

So... when I mind control a sectopod and tell him to march somewhere with full TUs, well, actually I only psied a "quartopod", anyhow, one of the other 3 quatopods will pretty much guaranteed burst fire and kill him.

Try it.

 

 

On the note of that those damage reduction modifiers and stuff... hey! Please confirm... the 80% resistance/ 120 effectiveness is applied to the damage BEFORE penetrating armor, not after, according to research?

 

Ie it's 100 (base) *90% (affectiveness) - 100(armor), not (100 - 100) * 90%

 

Right?

[NKF]

I'll confirm that. The multipliers are applied before armour takes away from the overall damage.

 

If it didn't, it would be quite hard to explain how weapons that do less damage than the armour are able to do any damage at all.

 

---

 

As for aiming, it's hard to say. I have damaged aliens on the right or left even when I was standing right next to it and facing it directly (this was early in my initial forays into working out the damage formula for myself - I was still trying to work out how armour worked at this time, and I was tweaking the alien's front armour until I could find a point where I couldn't do any damage to it with my laser pistol).

 

You'll have to imagine that the quarter you want to hit is a single sized unit looking in the general direction that the sectopod is facing (it is, after all, four units masquerading as one unit). The actual location that the bullet hits is dependant on how much the bullet drifts while it's travelling.

 

---

 

If you've got the luxury of wide open spaces - use the scout and sniper pair technique. "The aliens cannot shoot you if they can't see you". This applies mainly to avoiding reaction fire.

 

- NKF

[Jasonred]

Thanks guys.

 

Back on topic, one nasty mission I had when starting out involved running out of ammo on a high save and reload type game.

However, the last alien that I could see had panicked earlier from my no losses and his friends all being killed.

 

Irritating! Very very irritating! I knew I was in no danger whatsoever, yet I couldn't finish the mission either.

 

In the end, dragging just about EVERYTHING I could get my troopers to lug around into the skyranger (including corpses... which slowed me down a fair bit). I dusted off. Bah!

 

 

Another HORRIBLE mission I had early on was on a terror mission. I had cleverly armed quite a few of my men with HE auto-cannon stuff. Upon starting, I spot aliens near the skyranger and fire auto fire HE!!!

 

... stupid soldier hits the edge of the skyranger for all shots, blowing up just about all of my forces and rendering a lot more unconscious.

 

Same has happened with rocket launchers.

 

Stupid soldier! Never warning me whether you have a clear LOS or not!

[NKF]

It's this mysterious force known as drift - hate it, love it, it ruins shots or makes impossible shots possible.

 

I mainly use this strategy for firing blaster bombs out the back of the Skyranger, BUT, it applies to all explosive type weapons in general. Don't fire in a straight line. Fire at an angle out of the Skyranger. Basically aim it away from the bit you don't want it to clip, and make sure that the flight path allows the shell/rocket to completely miss the other side of the Skyranger (I wish this forum had screenshot posting capabilities - it's easier to describe some things in pictures than in words)

 

Or, if you're a high explosive nut like me (well, they're my bread and butter), you'd toss those out instead (I toss these out semi-blindly - the motion scanner helps). A lot safer than firing a missile - unless it drops short and the soldier it lands next to doesn't have 8 TUs...

 

High explosive day is a very dangerous day.

 

- NKF

 

P. S: With autocannons, wear power suits. They make you immune to your own AC-HE shells, unless you receive a direct hit. I've been able to maul mutons with superhuman armour to bits with ye bog standard autocannon with HE shells thanks to the power suits. Thumbs up I say. Thumbs up. One of the few weapons (like the laser pistol) that'll kill almost anything but superhuman sectopods.